Toyota News Thread

[KahnBB6]

This might not be a good development for Akio Toyoda... : /

They might be pursuing hybrids in the immediate but my impression has been that a lot of new Toyota and Lexus models are being designed as EVs already? The exceptions being GR models (hybrids) and some heavy duty models and H2 fuel cell electrics and some H2 combustion motorsports efforts.

Volume production solid state batteries and ultra-capacitors can't come fast enough for this and pretty much every automaker.

https://jalopnik.com/toyota-s-ev-strategy-might-be-akio-toyoda-s-undoing-t-1850528784

Despite being the darling of eco-conscious drivers 20 years ago with the launch of the Prius, Toyota has been stagnant in its efforts to electrify its range. Where outfits like VW have made efforts to electrify various segments of the market, Toyota was late to introduce a fully electric vehicle and now, when companies like BMW have four, or more, EVs in their ranges, Toyota still just has one: the bZ4x.
Now, that sluggish uptick in electric vehicles at Toyota could be about to hit company chairman Akio Toyoda’s vision for the future. According to The Wall Street Journal, the chairman of the company’s board is set to face a vote against his leadership brought on by the automaker’s shareholders. The WSJ reports:

Shareholders including the New York City comptroller’s office, the California Public Employees’ Retirement System and a handful of European asset managers say they have voted or plan to vote to oust several Toyota directors including Toyoda from their board seats at the meeting Wednesday.
While citing governance issues as one reason, they say their vote is also a protest against Toyoda’s policy of not setting a date by which the carmaker’s lineup will be all electric.

Brad Lander, the New York City comptroller and one of the shareholders looking to vote on the matter, told The WSJ that he wanted to be “persuaded that there is a transition” to EVs under way at Toyota.

There should be no surprise that the focus of this vote is on Toyoda. The 67-year-old has been a rare “voice of caution” against the auto industry’s infatuation with EVs. He believes the “world isn’t ready” to go all in on electric cars due to “problems such as inadequate charging infrastructure, shortages of battery materials and the reliance of many nations on carbon-emitting fossil fuels for electricity,” The WSJ reports.

The site reports that this might not be enough for Toyoda to lose his seat, and says that the chance of him losing a vote remains “minuscule.” However, it says that votes such as this are used to protest executives and help “nudge” businesses around to their way of thinking.

I guess the result of if this tactic works or not will be the day we finally see an all-electric lineup at Toyota. Let’s not hold our breath for that just yet.

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[XtremeMaC]

Toyota Ramps Up Commitment to Electrification with U.S. BEV Production and Additional Battery Plant Investment


https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota...tion-and-additional-battery-plant-investment/


They can try to oust Toyoda but doubtful that it'll change anything. The gears on EV are already turning at Toyota. Like many other late-to-the-game OEMs have discovered this is not an overnight change..

 

[KahnBB6]

Toyota Ramps Up Commitment to Electrification with U.S. BEV Production and Additional Battery Plant Investment


https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota...tion-and-additional-battery-plant-investment/


They can try to oust Toyoda but doubtful that it'll change anything. The gears on EV are already turning at Toyota. Like many other late-to-the-game OEMs have discovered this is not an overnight change..

Exactly. I am not so sure that Toyoda will be pushed out of his chairman position at this time. At the very least he'll still be heavily involved in the GR division's efforts in both production and motorsport. That's his baby after all.

Toyota Motor as a whole is 100% realizing they have to do more and better to catch up in the electrification race. They did lag and so now there is a lot of about-face (and saving of face) going on. But as we already know there ARE several battery electric and/or series hybrid range extended models in various phases of development for production right now. The Lexus IS model range being just one of them.

My hypothesis is that while this was already the direction for Lexus for many months now it was the Toyota brand which was previously going to take longer to fully switch over to full electrification. Now it seems that both the Lexus and Toyota brands are being accelerated even further.

Also... Akio Toyoda did lay groundwork before he stepped down as CEO to revamp and unify new electrified parts systems and architecture pipelines for hybrids and battery electrics alike. Perhaps he allowed Toyota to lag behind with EVs but he was thinking forward while he was still in there on the long term supplier and production fronts.

I'm not arguing that he couldn't have done more. He could have. But it's a complicated major shift for a company like Toyota to go from VOLUME gas combustion vehicles to VOLUME battery electric vehicles in a very short timeframe.

...

Aside, given how in demand and constrained the materials to make conventional batteries and solid state batteries will be for the immediate future I really hope this doesn't worsen the already annoying and inconvenient allocation-only model availability process in the U.S., Canada. and other countries.

Somehow with this big shift ongoing for Toyota I don't think we'll see a change to being able to place a true order for specific models and option combinations any time soon.

At the very least I hope it just won't be any more difficult than it already is to get the exact model, color and option combinations you want at reasonable prices while allowing for a couple to several months' wait time.

 

[XtremeMaC]

I don't blame Toyota and Toyoda one bit.

If you do a poll even right now vast majority will still say ICE. Whether that's because people don't like change, or haven't experienced EV or overly concerned about range anxiety with or without even considering their driving habits or namely so petrol heads or just overall don't like the int/ext looks of EVs out right now.

There are EV owners out there, joke or not, that carry petrol/diesel generators in their trunks. Anxiety is real. Diminishing battery life over time and battery perf in cold is real. Expensive replacement battery is real.. Lacking infrastructure is real. Losing power for days is real.. People living in apartments with no access to overnight charging are real.. I mean, really

Well ok, lack of engineering expertise in the EV area is limited. Companies already had many listings before EV, now with EV, everyone's looking at new grads or to hiring at low cost countries as H1B being is always capped.... because not enough electrical engineers in US to begin with, then many software/hardware eng, but not much expertise on automotive components. Then cybersecurity madness.. These are the hidden challenges of things.... Know-how and failure modes on EV's are surely lacking. Heck even firefighters' equipment are lacking to suppress battery fires.

In addition, there are number of companies out there with the resources to build you a mega battery factory, LG, Samsung, etc.. . Li-Ion access is not limitless... Toyota is going to spend billions like other OEMs instead of building MT Supras Then, as I said before, when subsidies from petrol go down, electricity is likely to get mor expensive.. TCO will increase.. How long will EV tax credit go on for?

Cost to overtake this challenge is massive. Investment, the profit margin, etc...
So many challenges...

Toyota bZ4X and Lexus RZ sound like a rushed attempt in some ways. low range, slow charge speed, expensive.. It's a start. Surely it'll get better. Not the worst by any means ahem Leaf and for sure no roof will fly off with Toyota.

Side note: I saw a blue Audi e-tron GT just an hour ago and well not bad.

 

[PerformanceSound]

I don't blame Toyota and Toyoda one bit.

If you do a poll even right now vast majority will still say ICE. Whether that's because people don't like change, or haven't experienced EV or overly concerned about range anxiety with or without even considering their driving habits or namely so petrol heads or just overall don't like the int/ext looks of EVs out right now.

Right, and for good logical reasons. Toyota is not "anti-EV", they are just extremely confident that going in all-EV is just not a sensible business decision right now (and probably not for a very long time). Consumer cost, R&D, availability, and consumer interest/use/support do not justify the spending costs for going in all-EV.

I always use the analogy of the Atari Jaguar and Panasonic 3DO gaming systems (some of you here probably have no idea what those were). The two gaming systems in the early 90's that were technologically advanced and powerful yet the vast majority of consumers couldn't afford them (consumer cost) and the lack of gaming developers (support) and poor consumer interest led to the failure of two gaming consoles.

We are not ready to move towards an all-EV manufacturing, sales, and support model for vehicles. Toyota understands this very well. Young people are the target cosumers for a sports car....young people cannot afford an all-EV sports car....an all-EV sports car costs almost twice as much to manufacture as an ICE powered sports car. End result?....sports cars segment dead. It is (currently) a lose/lose strategy.

 

[XtremeMaC]

I always use the analogy of the Atari Jaguar and Panasonic 3DO gaming systems (some of you here probably have no idea what those were)

damn, I'm 80's baby but can't recall those..

wow still can't afford it

This reminds me initially of the obsolete video recording betamax/etc. then HD-DVD, etc.. then of Ford using Tesla chargers and others to possibly follow suit. In that case it's availability/infrastructure/cost issue leading to possibly obsoletion of the charging standard, at least in the US. Definitely risky.. Gotta be trusting Elon to not have one of them Twitter episodes.

 

[GRMan]

News

Toyota just release their long term technological plan on carbon neutrality. They are well and truely ahead of other manufacturers that are just betting on BEV.

https://global.toyota/en/newsroom/corporate/39288520.html

https://www.reuters.com/business/au...-overshadow-shareholder-challenge-2023-06-13/

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

News

Toyota just release their long term technological plan on carbon neutrality. They are well and truely ahead of other manufacturers that are just betting on BEV.

https://global.toyota/en/newsroom/corporate/39288520.html

https://www.reuters.com/business/au...-overshadow-shareholder-challenge-2023-06-13/

LET'S GO!! The annoying climate cultists and globalists can shove this L up their ass. Pragmatism for the win!

 

[PerformanceSound]

LET'S GO!! The annoying climate cultists and globalists can shove this L up their ass. Pragmatism for the win!

I knew it!!! US politics getting in the way of good things:
"Investors also backed all 10 members of the board, including Chairman Akio Toyoda, despite concerns about board independence raised by prominent U.S. proxy advisers. The breakdowns of both votes won't be released until Thursday."

See, I told everyone that Toyota is smarter than that Toyota knows EV-only is a terrible business decision:
"Toyota says EVs are just one element in its multi-pathway approach to carbon neutrality that includes petrol-electric hybrids and hydrogen fuel cells."

Keep going Toyota, we are with you 100%!!!

 

[FLtrackdays]

Kudos Toyota for not just putting their eggs into one basket but creating new ones:

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a44204719/toyota-gr-performance-ev-manual/

 

[XtremeMaC]

Toyota Is Right: We Need More Hybrid Cars and Fewer EVs. Here’s Why
The auto industry is going all-in on EVs, but a more effective way to lower emissions quickly is staring us in the face.

https://www.thedrive.com/features/toyota-is-right-we-need-more-hybrid-cars-and-fewer-evs-heres-why

 

[FLtrackdays]

Toyota Is Right: We Need More Hybrid Cars and Fewer EVs. Here’s Why
The auto industry is going all-in on EVs, but a more effective way to lower emissions quickly is staring us in the face.

https://www.thedrive.com/features/toyota-is-right-we-need-more-hybrid-cars-and-fewer-evs-heres-why

Damn that article makes too much sense. I had to look them up. “We are an independent, editorially-driven, audience-first publication that aims to be agile and innovative in ways our legacy competitors cannot be. We aren’t beholden to tradition, to advertisers or to anyone else; we work for our readers and our readers alone.“

Great find BigMac !

Also, I didn’t realize how long it takes to charge one:

https://www.motortrend.com/features/how-long-does-it-take-to-charge-a-tesla?slide=5

Would suck if that was your only vehicle. Otherwise fun toys.

 

[supraboi]

Toyota May Yet Do a Tesla and Upend EVs

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2023-07-12/toyota-may-yet-do-a-tesla-and-upend-evs

 

[Evolution]

Also, I didn’t realize how long it takes to charge one:

https://www.motortrend.com/features/how-long-does-it-take-to-charge-a-tesla?slide=5

Would suck if that was your only vehicle. Otherwise fun toys.

Electric cars do take forever to charge. If I was to plug mine into a normal 120v outlet, it would take a good 5 days to charge (I used to do that and it really didnt work out). I currently have a dedicated 240v outlet that charges at 32 amps and it takes around 8 hours from 1/4 battery to full.

You literally have to plan your next day around the battery unless you dont mind stopping at the crazy fast chargers (big $). Last week, I forgot to plug my car in one night and it only had 60 miles remaining. I had a 90 mile day planned. So guess what? I drove the Supra instead. If my electric car was my only car, I would have either stayed home or spent time and money at a fast charger just so I could carry out my day.

 

[C-Pike]

Another airbag recall

https://www.autonews.com/regulation-safety/toyota-airbag-recall-includes-certain-2023-2024-models

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